The Journey to a Growth Mindset: Carol Dweck’s Live Keynote Presentation

The Journey to a Growth Mindset: Carol Dweck’s Live Keynote Presentation

– It is my great privilege to
introduce our keynote speaker, Carol Dweck is one of
the foremost scholars on the subject of motivation, and has conducted pioneer research on why people succeed, why they don’t, and how to foster success
through growth mindset practices. There is so much we could say about Carol but I’m gonna keep this short, because we all want to hear from her. Her work has been incredibly influential and has caught fire in education spaces, all of you know. Professor Dweck is on the
faculty of Stanford University and one of the many things
that she does every year is she teaches a freshman seminar course, small group of freshmen on mindsets. She’s the author of Mindset:
The New Psychology of Success, and we are thrilled to have her today at Leaders to Learn From. Professor Dweck, welcome. (audience applauds) – Thank you. A few months ago a colleague sent me a picture of her nephew. He had just turned on a
computer for the first time. – [Audience] Aw! (audience laughs) – All of our students were once like that. We were once like that. But just a few years
later, we’re seeing this. And this. What happened? And how can we give them back their zest for learning? That’s what my work is about, that’s why I went into this field. And that’s why I’m here to
talk about the mindsets. In our work we find that students can have more of a fixed mindset where they think of their talents and
abilities as fixed traits. You have a certain amount and that’s it. Or they can think of their abilities more as something they can develop through their effort, their strategies, and their input from others. They don’t necessarily
think everyone’s the same, but they understand that
everyone can get smarter. Now one of my themes today is it’s not either/or, we’re all a mixture of both mindsets. My talk today will have two parts. One is how and why mindsets matter? And I’ll make that short, ’cause
I really want to have time to talk with the wonderful Jenny Edwards, but the second half is how to make the journey to a
growth mindset more successful for educators and for students. Now in our work we’ve seen over and over that students’ mindsets matter. We often assess students’ mindsets at the beginning of a
challenging transition. We ask them questions like agree or disagree your
intelligence is something basic about you that
you can’t really change. That’s a fixed mindset. And we see if they agree more with that or more with growth mindset items. And then we monitor their performance. Recently we had the privilege of studying all the 10th grade students
in the country of Chile. (audience member yells) (audience laughs) Thank you, Chile. (laughs) And so we assessed students’ mindsets and what we found was I think truly remarkable. On left you have language, achievement test scores on the right. You have math achievement test scores. Across the bottom you
have their income level. And then on the vertical axis you have their achievement test score. The broken line on top,
those are the students who endorsed a growth mindset, and the students on the bottom, that solid line, a fixed mindset. You can see at every single level of family income, the students who held
more of a growth mindset, substantially outperformed the kids who endorse more of a fixed mindset. But the most amazing thing was that when a poor student
had a growth mindset, they performed at the level of much, much, much,
much, much richer students with a fixed mindset. So that was really interesting how much having a growth mindset
boosted the achievement especially of the low-income kids. Also in many studies,
we’ve been able to teach a growth mindset, either through in-person instruction where, in this case, students
making the transition to 7th grade, many of them already showing declining grades were
divided into two groups. Half of them, the control group, learned valuable study skills, but the other half learned the skills with a growth mindset. The growth mindset sessions
kicked off with this article, You Can Grow Your Intelligence:
New Research Shows the Brain Can Be Developed Like a Muscle. They learned that every
time they stretched out of their comfort zone to
learn something new and hard and they stuck to it, the
neurons in their brain formed new and stronger connections, and over time they could get smarter. They learned how to apply
this to their schoolwork. And when we checked in
at the end of the year, we found that the students
in the control group, the red line, continued
to show declining grades, but the students who
learned growth mindset with the study skills showed a sharp rebound in their grades. Since then we’ve developed online programs to teach a growth mindset. And in the process we asked,
“Is it ever too late?” So we went around to a
bunch of high schools and in one of the high schools the administration and
the teachers warned us that we were wasting our time. They said it’s too late
for these students, go help younger kids. But we sent out our computer-based growth mindset workshop over the internet. We sent it originally to
13 different high schools, and just within a few months we found a jump in grades for the lower-achieving kids. In this case it was the lower third. Since then, we’ve revised and
tested, revised and tested our online workshop and right now we’ve sent it out to thousands and thousands
of kids around the country. And in the pilot for that
study, we found that not only did we raise the grades of more kids, we raised the challenge seeking,
the desire for challenge of kids across the achievement spectrum. Isn’t that what we want? Don’t we want all these
kids challenging themselves, eager to learn something hard and new? So we’re really excited. And this program we’ve developed, once we know it’s solid, that
it reaches a lot of kids, and it affects their
motivation and performance, we’re just gonna release it, and that should be in
the next year or two. It’s a battle within us all. So if a growth mindset’s so great, why don’t we all have it all the time? And the answer is this. There are so many things
in the environment that trigger a fixed mindset
that make us feel judged, so that when we face a challenge, if we’re triggered into a fixed mindset, we think, “I better not look dumb. “I better not work harder or ask for help, “that’ll make me feel dumb.” And especially if you make
mistakes or fail something, get out of there. Turn it off. But, if we become able
as students or adults to stay in that growth
mindset, the challenge becomes an opportunity to learn. Working hard using
strategies, getting help, that’s how you learn. And when we have difficulty, that’s another opportunity to take stock and learn. And once we get kids into that deeply effective, deeply committed learning stage, those grades and test scores should be a natural by-product of that. It’s all about deep
and effective learning. And it’s all about creating an environment where students can stay in
that growth mindset place and not be triggered into a state of threat and defensiveness, a state of smart and dumb worry. Okay, so that’s kind of my whirlwind tour. Now, the journey to a growth mindset. And I’d like to start
with the good old days, some kind of reminiscing. And in the good old days, we
used to think it was simple, that the growth mindset
was a simple concept. It looked simple, feels simple. You believe abilities can be developed, and we also thought once adults have it, they could easily pass it on to kids, it would kind of naturally
show in their practices and kids would pick that up. We were wrong on both counts. So let’s look at this more closely. What is a growth mindset? And what we’re finding is that there are common misunderstandings. Many educators think a growth mindset is being open-minded, flexible. You often hear people talk
about an open mindset. Well whatever it is, I’m
sure it’s a good thing. It’s not a growth mindset. And when you drift away
from that definition, you’re not gonna do the things
that foster a growth mindset. Telling students they can do anything may or may not work, and it may lead them to disappointment if you
don’t give them the skills and introduce them to
the resources to do that. Or most commonly many educators equate a
growth mindset with effort, encouraging students to work hard. And that’s what I’m gonna focus on. But again, a growth
mindset is simply believing that talents and abilities
can be developed. So growth mindset’s not just about effort. Developing abilities
also involves strategies and help, support, advice,
and guidance from others. We can’t leave those out. And here’s why it’s important. Think about these reassuring-sounding statements. “You would have done better
if you’d tried harder.” “Keep trying and you’ll get it.” People say these things in
the name of a growth mindset. And they sound good, but
“You would have done better “if you tried harder.” Maybe, maybe not. If the student didn’t
have the understanding or the strategies, didn’t
know where to go next, they can try, but they
may not make progress. Or, “keep trying and you’ll get it.” Same thing. Maybe they won’t get it
and if they don’t get it, they’ll feel all the more inept. As opposed to asking a student, “What strategies have you tried? “Let’s figure out what your
understanding of this is, “and let’s talk about
where you might go next.” So probing for understanding rather than saying, “Try hard.” “You worked so hard. “That’s wonderful.” Ways in which it may not be so wonderful. Many times a parent will say to me, “It’s not working. “I told, I praised my child’s
effort and it’s not working.” And I said, “Well, is
your child trying hard?” “No, not really,” So, how’s that gonna work? How’s that working for you? Or, praise the child when they didn’t make any progress or they didn’t learn anything. And it is fine to praise
the effort part of it, but effort is not the ultimate value. Learning and progress and improvement are the ultimate values. And effort is one root to learning and improvement. Someone asked me recently,
“What keeps you up at night?” And it’s this, it’s the fear that my work which grew up to counter the failed self-esteem movement, will be used for the same purpose, trying to make kids feel good, but losing sight of learning. The growth mindset is meant to be a tool to help students learn to
close achievement gaps, not a way to make kids feel
good about not learning. Here’s the second part of that journey, changing educators’ mindsets. A year or so ago, maybe two years now, a colleague in Australia
named Susan Mackey told me she was seeing
a lot of what she called false growth mindset. I said, “Susan, what
are you talking about? “It’s a simple concept. “Why would people have
a false growth mindset “when they could have
a true growth mindset?” Didn’t make sense to me. But she had planted the seed and then I saw it everywhere. And when I thought about
it, I started to understand that educators were kind of seeing that there was a choice. What kind of person am I? But there really was no choice ’cause if you were in a setting
that said a growth mindset was good and the thing to have, you really didn’t have a choice. But people might ask themselves, “Am I the good, growth mindset “fairy godmother who develops “children’s brains and
helps them learn or,” and I see your smiles, “am I that fixed mindset teacher “who poisons their mind
and stunts their growth?” Well, it’s like obvious, right? You are the good person, so you must have, and you have many fine qualities, so you must have a growth mindset. But, there’s no journey there. You can’t just proclaim that you have what you see as the more benevolent view. And now we understand you can’t
get there without a journey. So what’s the first step on that journey? And by the way, we have
become so committed to understanding that journey. So what’s the first step? You’ll be surprised to hear me say this. Let’s legitimize that fixed mindset, because we all have it somewhere. Acknowledge that we’re all a mixture. And then start watching for those fixed mindset triggers. What triggers you into a fixed mindset? Is it when you’re confronting a challenge? Do you feel anxious? Maybe you’ll be revealed as less competent than you hope? When you’re confronting
a struggle or setback or criticism, do you become
discouraged, defensive? When you meet someone who
is better than you are at something you prize yourself on, do you hate them just a little bit? (audience laughs) Or do you say, “Wow, how’d
they develop those skills? “Maybe I can learn from them.” When you’re in the classroom and you see a student
struggling or confused, do you wonder about their ability? Students not listening to your lesson. Do you think bad things about them? A student’s learning quickly, do you think, “Oh,
that’s a smart student”? So what are your fixed mindset triggers? We all have them. Get to know them. Get to know your fixed mindset persona. When does it show up? How does it make you feel? How does it affect your behavior? Your relationships? The goals that you’re trying to pursue? And over time, learn to
work with that persona. So I was watching Susan Mackey work with some bank executives in Australia. She had them give them their
fixed mindset personas names. And this kind of buttoned up suit, who was the head of the unit, was talking about his
fixed mindset persona. He said, “When we’re in a crunch, “when we have a deadline and I’m not sure “we’re gonna make it, Duane shows up. (audience laughs) “And Duane makes me critical “and mean and bossy.” And then the other people in
his unit said things like this: “So yeah, and when your Duane shows up, “my Yanni comes roaring out. “And my Yanni, macho male, makes me cower “and grovel and do all
the things that you hate, “which makes your Duane furious.” And they were talking about that and I thought it was fabulous, and that group used to
have the lowest morale in the organization and they shot way up. They’re getting an award this year for the progress they’ve made. So, name it, claim it, and talk about it. And over time recruit it to work with you on your
growth mindset goals. And here is part three of the journey. And remember in the good old days, we thought that once adults had a growth mindset, they
could easily pass it on. But we have now been
encountering over and over a very surprising finding. In our work and the recent work of others, we have found that there is very little relationship between a teacher or a parent’s growth mindset and their students’ or childrens’ growth mindset. And we thought, “Oh my
God, how is that possible?” But as with everything we become determined to figure it out and we do the research and
here’s what we’re finding. That in many cases, the educators’ walk is not matching their talk. So, in one beautiful
study by Kathy Liu Sun, she researched middle school math teachers. Many of them used the words growth mindset in their classrooms, but their practice wasn’t
consistent with it. And what she found was that it was only when the teachers were
teaching for understanding and we’re giving kids feedback in a way that grew their understanding and were giving them a
chance to revise their work to demonstrate their
improved understanding. That’s when they were passing
on their growth mindset. It wasn’t about having
it live in your head or about saying the words, it was about walking the walk. Similarly, in a study
by Yang and colleagues, they found that many math
teachers, again math teachers, were professing a growth mindset, but it’s only when they sat with the kids who were stuck or confused. And so, let’s see what you’re doing, and let’s see what
you’re understanding is, let’s see where we can go next. Those kids were developing
more of a growth mindset. We’re doing research with parents, too, and finding that some parents treat
the child’s setback or failure as those it’s harmful for them, it’s gonna blow their confidence and interfere with their learning. So they either show
their anxiety and concern or they kind of go, “Oh,
it’s okay, you don’t have “to be good at everything,” (mumbles) and the child hears, “You don’t
think I have the ability.” But, other parents
think failure, setbacks, mistakes, those are helpful
and they treat them that way. They don’t get super positive about it, super negative about it, anxious, it’s more matter of fact,
“Oh, that’s interesting, “let’s talk about it,
let’s see what we can do, “let’s see where we can go from there.” And those kids are
developing a growth mindset. We recently published a
study of parents’ praise to their toddlers when they’re, actually their babies and toddlers, we coded, (clears throat) excuse me, parent-child interactions from video tapes. And when the child was one,
two, and three years of age, and they were coded for the kind of praise the mother was giving to the children, and we found that the more the mothers used process praise, which
is praise for hard work, strategies, so trying many things, getting help, the greater proportion of that praise, the mother’s praise, was focused on the child’s process, the more the child had a growth mindset, and a higher desire for challenge. Five years later, when the
child was in second grade, and we just found the
more they were achieving in math and language areas,
two years after that, when they were in fourth grade. It can always be changed,
but it’s powerful. That process praise was teaching children their abilities can grow. It can always be changed,
but it’s powerful. And now I feel entitled
to interfere in airports. (audience laughs) You’d be surprised how many
people are telling their babies they’re brilliant, and by the way, I have interfered in airports. So let’s recap the practices that create growth mindsets. Teaching for conceptual understanding, so that kids feel that
understanding growing. Sit with children and
ask them to show them what they’ve done, figure
out how they are thinking and where they could go next? Treat setbacks as beneficial for learning. Focus on the child’s process and tie it to learning. So not just praising efforts, strategies, but tying it to the child’s actual learning and progress. And a few more pointers. Use the neuroscience. Kids tell us before they have the growth mindset workshop that effort and difficulty
made them feel dumb, but now when they’re really
stretching themselves, they can feel those neurons making new and stronger connections. Give them that gift of that image. With adolescents, let them
author their own learning of a growth mindset. We have found in our
research the worse thing we can do is say, “Well, we
adults have found the answer, “and we’d like to help you.” Even when we send out online in workshops, we say, “Look,
we’re developing these “for kids in the future,
and we’d like your input.” And that’s true, we use
their input to revise. That makes them feel ownership. We give them quotes from other teams who have gone through. We have them advise future students on how to implement a growth mindset. So, let it come from them. And we’re also learning
to link growth mindset to the child’s larger goals. So they don’t want to grow their brains to do well on achievement tests, I mean that’s not the ultimate in life, and my fear is that with
all the emphasis on grades and achievement test scores, that becomes their larger goal or getting into the next school. And yet, every child has within them a wonderful contribution. And we have found that when we ask them to think about the contribution
they would like to make to their family, to their community, to society in the future, and we link that growth mindset growing your brain to
making that contribution in the future, kids are
so much more motivated. So a growth mindset is not a panacea. But it does empower kids and help them learn. So, why don’t we as educators take that journey to our growth mindset? Bring our walk into line with our talk, so that our growth mindset becomes our students’ growth mindset as well. Thank you. (audience applauds) Thank you. – Thank you very much, Carol. That was incredibly relevant, I think to all of us and all our work. So I wanna know when my
father, when I would come home with a 99% or a 98% on a test and he said, “Why didn’t you get a 100?” Did that foster my growth mindset? – I don’t think so. – I don’t think so. I’m thinking it certainly motivated me at some level, I guess. So to remind us, Carol and her research and the folks she works with have found that students’ mindsets, how they perceive their abilities, play a key role in their
motivation and achievement. And that they found that if
we change students’ mindsets, we can boost their achievement. So in diving down a little bit, here’s what’s gonna happen. I’m gonna take 10, 15 minutes to ask a few handful or more questions. We’ll try to get through, you
know, move really quickly, and then we do have mic
runners, Jason and Tracy are gonna be available and
I’d love to be able to get several questions in. So we may even tee up a few at a time, so Carol can be responsive. So in diving down to get
even maybe more concrete than you were able to already get, so what have you found to be the influences that for how a student perceives his mindset? – So, we talked a lot about the messages that the student is getting
from the environment: the failure messages, the praise, the focus on understanding, but I’d also love to bring
in the larger culture of the school that we become
very, very interested in. And we are finding with
all kinds of organizations, we haven’t looked at schools yet, but all kinds of
organizations, that when people in an organization think that the organization believes in developing abilities, they feel more empowered,
they feel more committed, they take on more
innovation and creativity, and whereas the people in the more fixed mindset organizations feel, “Oh, if something
better comes along, “I’m gonna take that.” There’s a lot of, they
report a lot of cheating and cutting corners, you know, because they want to get ahead in that smart, dumb, talent, non-talent. So we’re really, really becoming committed to understanding what
is the larger culture that allows teachers and students to feel, to feel safe, to feel that we’re out for your development, we’re not here to sort you into who can succeed and who can’t. – What about their, students’ peers? – The peers are really important. And one of the most exciting
things I hear from people is that when it’s a
culture of development, the peers band together and do things, and I’ve heard about skits and rap songs about growth mindset, it’s kind of like they
can really band together around learning. I haven’t heard so much
that they band together around standardized testing. – That’s good. So I was thinking about
when you were talking, you were talking about
measuring a person’s, whether a student or a grownup’s mindset, what does that look like? – So we have these measures
just for research purposes. We have a set of questions,
you are intelligent, something very basic about you
that you can’t really change, versus everyone no matter
who they are can become a lot more intelligent. We just use those for research purposes, and we talked about how
recently people are talking about accountability for some of these noncognitive measures. We’re not there. We’re not there in terms of measurement, because kids can, teachers know what’s the right answer to check and kids can be taught what’s
the right answer to check. So we’re not there in
terms of measurement. And also, as you saw from my talk, we’re not there yet in
terms of teaching educators how to pass it on. That is our number one research focus now. We want to create online
materials for educators how to introduce and
implement a growth mindset with their classroom,
but we’re not there yet. And we don’t want to
see a mandate to teach growth mindset to kids
that causes teachers to do it in a way that’s not effective. – So the new Federal
law that recently passed does include these noncognitive, I don’t even like any of the ways they’re kind of clumped together. Are you getting inquiries already? – Yes. Many inquiries. And on the one hand, I’m thrilled that these factors are now understood to be a
central part of education and are something, are
things that drive learning. That’s key to me, the recognition that these are things that
drive students’ learning. But we’re not ready for that, or some areas might be,
but we are not ready for that accountability part. – And I don’t know that
you and I talked about this when we were thinking
about the kinds of issues we wanted to cover off
on the CORE district in California, have you worked with them? – I have worked a little bit with them. – Because they are trying to incorporate some of these measures
into other ways of– – Yes, yes. And again, there may be
some noncognitive skills, more like skills that are ready for that, and some good assessments
may have been developed for those skill thing, but these more mindsets, beliefs, patterns of behavior, we’re not there yet. – So, Carol, you talked a bit about, and what I put on my notes here was this kind of
perception versus reality. Your walk and talk, I think, metaphor. Do you see it more in students or grownups or, you know, the difference,
I have a growth mindset, but when you measure it, I really don’t. And, just what is that,
how do you think about moving people who think they
have a growth mindset to but really don’t to that? – We see it more in the adults. The kids, the kids tell it like it is. But I don’t blame the adults. I feel like we may have communicated, or we may even have believed it was simple to achieve a growth mindset, or that you could achieve a growth mindset rather than embark on this more
difficult life-long journey. But now we see we’re trying to spell out what are the steps of that journey. And I mentioned to you a minute ago, in my freshman seminar,
I used to tell them, “How are you moving
toward a growth mindset?” And a lot of them would say, “Oh, I’ve always had a growth mindset.” And I’d look, “What do you mean?” I don’t think that’s true, but, I didn’t quite say it that way. But now I give the assignment, what are your fixed mindset triggers. Name your fixed mindset persona, and bring it on board with you. Tell me how you’re
gonna bring it on board. Everybody writes in gory detail about their fixed mindset triggers, their fixed mindset persona, you know, and they’ll name it from their picky Aunt Ruth, or their critical Uncle Henry, or one student gave it his middle name, because it is sort a part of him, but it’s not the main part of him. And it’s about moving more toward being able to stay in a growth mindset place more of the time and not letting that fixed
mindset persona subvert you. And once that becomes the
language of the school, people can joke about
it and talk about it. Well, there I was, and this
is what the student did, and Henrietta came
roaring in, and this is, I caught her, but this
is what she wanted to do, and this is what I did instead. – So you told me about another
assignment you’ve given your students in the seminar. – Oh, yeah. I give them an assignment to do something outrageously, bold, italicized, exclamation
point growth mindset. Something outrageously growth mindset, something they never
would have done otherwise, but that will help them change in an important way they want to change. So last year, one young man was outrageously, well extremely shy. He realized the whole Stanford experience was passing him by. He sat in his dorm room
while everyone else networked and joined clubs. And for the assignment he decided to run for president of his dorm. The night came for the campaign speeches. He was, you know, kind of waiting in line, and he thought, I can still
go sit down and not do this, but then what will I write for my paper? (audience laughs) So he got up there, he gave his speech, and he won. He became the center of
social life in his dorm. He then tried out for
the freshman class play, he joined a salsa group that
salsaed all over the region, and he just went from there. – I love that. You’ve said that a growth mindset is not– – So, just one more thing. – Please, please. – You can all do that as
a group in your schools and come back and report. It’s really hilarious. (audience laughs) – Or not. (audience laughs) So, Carol, you’ve said
that a growth mindset is not just about effort, and we were hearing
quite a lot about that, that students need a
repertoire of approaches. – Yes. – You again said that. What are some of those approaches, though, and not just what they’re
not, but how do you, you know, I want folks
to be able to go home with at least a few, very
concrete strategies or tactics. – Yes, so, thinking about different strategies. If students learn to think about what can I do to help myself here, what are some other things I can try? We are finding in our research that that one question when you’re stuck or when you’re confronting
something difficult, what can I do to help myself, is really magical. What can I try? Did that work? Should I stick to that strategy? Should I try something else? Just knowing that they’ve
tried a few things so that even when you sit
down with them to say, “Let’s see what you’ve done, “let’s figure it out,” and you
say, “What have you tried?” Maybe it’s good to have them have tried a few things that
they can tell you about. That’s really important. And then in our society,
there’s often a stigma about asking for help. But we need to teach kids and teachers how to ask for help at the
right time, not right away. After they’ve tried some things, when they’re truly stuck, and also not just asking for the answer, but asking for input that will help them know where to go next. – You know, you started, or
you actually were answering something that I’m interested in, when you think about a deficit model, where everybody has or people can say “Here’s why a student can’t learn.” Everything’s always or often
couched in the negative versus an asset way of
looking at it, right? – Yes. – And so, why do you think people default that way? Is it easier? – Oh, wow. You know, my heart is
still broken from hearing that some educators are saying,
“That child can’t learn, “he has a fixed mindset,” or things like that. Or yelling at the class, “Look
at the chart in the front, “you don’t have a growth mindset, “what’s wrong with you?” It’s like, hello. – Do you think that’s protective? – Yes, I think it’s protective. And we used to say the kids
didn’t have the ability. Now we’re saying they
don’t have the mindset? I think it’s protective. It’s sort of like, “It’s not my fault “the child isn’t learning. “They’ve had bad teaching in the past, “they have, they come from
a certain background.” There’s always this way
of absolving yourself. And maybe it isn’t all your fault, but now you have this
incredible opportunity to open up a human being to learning. So you don’t want excuses for why that child can’t learn. You want to try everything in your power to open them up to that learning. – So I have wondered
about the relationship of your work to the efforts to improve school climate and culture, you have addressed that, at least to some degree, but I’m also interested in
the relationship of your work to the big push now for
social and emotional learning kinds of tactics. Do you see a crosswalk there? – I think social emotional learning is similar and different. My work mindsets is focused on attitudes, beliefs that help kids to learn. Social emotional learning
is bigger than that. Some of those are wonderful attributes, kindness, cooperation, so those are wonderful, the
school is a wonderful place to teach kids those values, I see it as a little bit separate. – Yeah, yeah. Here’s it, so we’re gonna take questions, so I hope you all have been thinking and the mic runners, Jason’s there, I see Tracy’s there. So I’ll, and you know what, let’s stand. – Let’s stand. – It’s kinetic for us, and I want you all to be able to see Carol. So, let me see some hands for
people who have questions, Brian, and I’m gonna do like two, so I’m gonna put Jason on
one, and then Tracy on one. So you’ve got here, say who you are, and where your district,
or who you are with, and to Carol. – [Voiceover] I’m Wenda Rouay, and I’m from Williamsville,
New York, outside of Buffalo. and your work has been
life changing for me, I want to start by saying that. But I wanted to ask you specifically. You talked about some of the
things that we can praise our kids including my
toddler grandchildren, like hard work, applying
strategies, asking for help, could you talk a little bit
about the role of reflection as one of those things that
supports a growth mindset? – Yes. – That’s great. Carol, just a second, ’cause
I think it’ll go faster, we’ll get more in, Tracy,
you’ve got a question? – Oh, let me answer, because– – Go ahead, go ahead. – By the time I finish my
answer, I don’t remember what the second question is. I get so involved in my answer. So, reflection is a wonderful thing where you reflect on a problem, you reflect on what you’ve tried, you reflect on its, on the efficacy of the strategy you tried. You think about when
is it time to get help. So reflection is good. Reflection in a fixed mindset can go awry. I didn’t get this, it’s hard, maybe I’m not smart, what does this mean about
me, blah, blah, blah, blah. All the rumination that we know leads to depression or discouragement. So, the kind of metacognitive reflection where you reflect on your strategies and their efficacy or what
resources might be helpful, that’s a great kind of reflection. – [Voiceover] Great, thank you. – [Voiceover] Hi, my
name is Janette Moore, and I own a tutoring company in New York and I also teach at Western
Connecticut State University, and I had a question in
regard to your research. Is there any current
research that is studying the role of mindset development with professors and students? – Yes. – [Voiceover] So that
bridge between senior year and freshman year of college? – Okay, yes, so. One of my former students, Mary Murphy is studying college students and finding that some students, especially in STEM fields,
science, technology, engineering and math, and
finding that many students believe that their professors
think only some kids can learn and do well in those subjects. And they actually say that. They’re sitting in
classes and writing down what professors say. Some of them say, “If
it’s not easy for you, “you don’t belong here.” Or, “Half of you will be
gone in a week or two, “and that’s as it should be.” But other students perceive their professors to say, “Anyone can learn this.” And their professors say things like, “Everyone in this room can learn, “and we are here to
make sure that happens. “We will sit with you as long as you need, “until you understand this material.” And the finding is that women and underrepresented
minorities blossom when they perceive that their professor in STEM fields has this
growth mindset perspective. – That’s great. Brian, you had a, you’ve got a– – [Voiceover] Yes. Good afternoon, Dr. Dweck,
my name is Brian Pick, I work for D.C. public schools. I love my job but really right now I wish you were a freshman
at Stanford University. There’s a lot of buzz right
now in education circles about concepts like grit, perseverance, productive struggle. I would be curious to hear your thought on how growth mindset is or isn’t kind of those concepts as well. – Yes, thank you for that question. There’s research showing that growth mindset is a basis for grit. So, the two together could
make a nice combination, ’cause how do you teach grit? And we don’t want to think it’s something some people have and some don’t, and so some will succeed and some won’t. But if we understand
that there are beliefs and mindsets that are
at the basis of grit, then we can begin to understand how to teach those qualities, those patterns of behavior to more kids. – Cory, did you include
resilience in that? – [Voiceover] Yeah. – [Moderator] Yeah. – Well, bouncing back from setbacks is at the heart of growth mindset. – Um, Tracy, Marty. – [Voiceover] Hi, Marty Blank with the Institute for
Educational Leadership. Can you talk about growth mindset through the lens of racial equity? – Yes. – [Voiceover] And to what
extent your last comment to this questioner here
it suggested, reminded me that we have, continue
to have a predominately white teacher workforce
working within an increasingly minority student population. Are there a set of
assumptions and stereotypes that view whether children are fixed or growth in their mindset? – Yeah, and whether teachers view them through a fixed or a growth lens. So we’re finding that our growth mindset workshops have an even more beneficial effect for students who are members of underrepresented groups. We’re finding, as I said, the teachers who are walking the growth mindset walk are having a disproportionately positive effect on students who are underrepresented in those fields. We are totally committed to issues of equity and to studying how to close those achievement gaps. In other research, ours and others, we found that when students learn the growth mindset, and then go into a stereotyped or threatening situation, they’re not as affected by
those negative stereotypes, ’cause they’re thinking, it’s not fixed. It’s a matter of learning,
developing these skills. I can do that. And they also understand
that when they get the growth mindset message,
the person delivering the message is looking at them through a growth mindset lens, not through the lens of a
stereotype about ability. – So. – Yeah, all right, I’ll stop there. – No, please. Jason, do you have a question? Hand up, Michael. Op, we got one beside. You’re now in the queue. – [Voiceover] I’m in the field of English language learner education. And we have three decades of research indicating the failure of
teacher preparation programs to overcome that deficit perspective on the part of teachers toward
English language learners and other culturally and
linguistically-diverse learners. Based on your research, what recommendations would you have? What would be your vision for
teacher preparation programs to transform that? Since after three decades,
nobody that I know of has been successful in it. – So it’s really interesting, because in the developmental
psychology literature, bilingualism is a huge advantage. Our kids have more, a stronger executive function if they’re able to work in two languages, et cetera. I think one important thing would be to teach in teacher preparation programs that bilingualism confers
cognitive advantages, I think that would go a long way. But then also, to have them generate ways in which coming from a different culture, having a different linguistic background, could be an asset that the child brings
rather than a deficit. So, I think that kind of
discussion and orientation in itself would be very valuable. – Michael, would you
like to follow on that? You were gonna ask a question. – [Voiceover] Ah, yes. – Yeah, here comes Jason, he’s on the run. Superintendent Matsuda. – [Voiceover] Thank you, yes, I’m Mike Matsuda from Anaheim
Union School District. So one of the leaders to learn from, that I’ve learned from,
Steve Sanibel from Colorado was from a district that
has competency-based and mastery-based learning. It seems to me a natural fit,
but would you comment on that? – Oh, yeah, I think mastery-based learning is a wonderful fit with growth mindset, especially if students are reminded of their progress. So, you know, when you are confused, you feel like, oh I’m back to square one. Even my graduate students feel that way. And you lose sight of
all the way you’ve come, the distance you’ve traversed. So mastery learning with emphasis on progress, with showing students how their good work habits, if they’ve done those good work habits, have fostered the learning,
the strategies they’ve tried, the resources they’ve used. Very, very compatible. – You know, it strikes me, Carol, that in business and other sectors, the notion of failing
is actually celebrated. – In some quarters, yes. In Silicon Valley,
– [Moderator] Work on it fast, iterate and move on. – Yes, exactly, Silicon
Valley, absolutely. – Well, I mean, it strikes me that some of it is, but not
the iterate of process, right? – Yes, exactly. – All right, we have time
for one more question. Jason’s got one. – [Voiceover] Hi, I’m Mary
Kay Carlo with Scholastic, how are you? – Fine. – [Voiceover] So I though
about what you said today, and a professor at my daughter’s college also is a professor at Harvard. And he made the comment that
at their particular school in the STEM program, they really do try to weed the kids out. Where at the Harvard, when
he teaches at Harvard, there’s this culture that
we want to keep the student, we don’t want to lose anybody. Once they’re there,
they want to keep them, so completely different culture. But what about this idea,
that students are able to collaborate a lot at Harvard? – That’s good. – [Voiceover] And so do you think– – Collaboration is wonderful. You know, in real life you collaborate. In real life, my research
wouldn’t be what it is if I didn’t talk all
day with my colleagues and design studies and everyone runs out and does their part. Real life is about collaboration, it’s about knowing how to
put your minds together to create something greater. It has to be orchestrated well, but rarely in real life do you sit down at your desk just, well maybe it’s not so rare, but it shouldn’t be that
you sit down, learn, take a test, everyone around
you is doing the same thing, but no one talks about it. It should be collaborative. – I’d like you all to join me. I first of all want you to know, I’ve named my fixed mindset self, and for reasons I will
not divulge, it is Chip. Whoo. There’s steep meaning there. Let’s all thank Carol
for her time and message. (audience applauds) Thank you, Carol.


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